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cardan demonteren ww14 tips : Techniek

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cardan demonteren ww14 tips

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cardan demonteren ww14 tips

Berichtdoor w114wouter » 30 dec 2016, 08:55

Hi allen,

Ik wil van het weekend de complete cardan demonteren omdat er een vervelende dreun in de wagen zit in de 4e versnelling tussen 65km en 110kmh. Dan kan ik hem eens inspecteren op slijtage en evt weg laten brengen voor revisie/balanceren.

Heeft er iemand nog tips voor ik er aan begin ? Heb dit klusje nog nooit gedaan maar het lijkt me geen wereldklus. Wellicht zie ik iets over het hoofd. Kan dit bijvoorbeeld in je eentje ? Ik heb wel een brug tot beschikking.
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Re: cardan demonteren ww14 tips

Berichtdoor Wiebren240D » 30 dec 2016, 12:48

Hallo Wouter

is niet echt moeilijk maar ik denk dat het niet nodig is om de gehele achteras onder je auto vandaan te halen.
je zegt er zit een brom in je auto.
kijk dan eerst naar de speling op de steek assen de assen zitten vast in het differentieel als je probeert de assen heen en weer te doen mag je niks geen ruimte voelen is dat wel het geval dan mankeert er wat een je schimringen zitten er niet in of de verkeerde gemonteerd als deze 2 ringen er linke en rechts niet in zitten dan is de kans groot dat je differentieel stuk is.

ik wens je suc6 met de zoektocht.
met de groeten van Wiebren ut Snits
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Re: cardan demonteren ww14 tips

Berichtdoor w114wouter » 30 dec 2016, 13:07

Hi Wiebren,

Dank voor je reactie. Ik ben niet specifiek geweest denk ik. Het gaat om de cardan (tussen bak en differentieel).

Grt Wouter
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Re: cardan demonteren ww14 tips

Berichtdoor Ronny » 30 dec 2016, 13:27

Bedoel je dan heen en weer draaien of in en uitgaande beweging??
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Re: cardan demonteren ww14 tips

Berichtdoor Dester4749 » 30 dec 2016, 16:35

Hallo,dan heb je de cardanaslager in de midden kapot hoodwaarschijnlijk want zoiets heb ik zelf ook eens gehad.
Gr,Dester4749.
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Re: cardan demonteren ww14 tips

Berichtdoor PascalvD » 30 dec 2016, 17:42

even voor de mee lezers en mee denkers het gaat dus zo te snappen om de aandrijf as van bak naar differentieel
iedereen noemt het weer anders :whistle:

hardy schijven los pakken meestal sleutel 17 en 15 of inbus 6 of 8 en sleutel 17
van te voren de as deeling markeren (anders krijg je onbalans
dan het lagerhuis los pakken en dan komt ie zo naar benenden

misschien moet de uitlaat nog weg maar dat moet je net ff zien de ene lukt het zo en de ander net niet


succes gr pascal


ps nog een tip verwacht met /8 sleutelen niet dat alle onderdelen 123 klaar liggen hier wil nog wel eens wat levertijd over heen komen dus even een weekend klusje kan wel een lang weekend worden en de meeste onderdelen leveranciers houden zaterdag rond 12 uur op dan word onderdeel zoeken wel heel lastig dus mocht je iets willen vervangen dan is het soms makkelijker om dit maandags te bestellen en het weekend daarna te vervangen het is maar een tip en als je de tijd en ruimte heb om stil te staan is het geen ramp maar als dit niet zo is dan kan je wel eens vervelend uit komen
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Re: cardan demonteren ww14 tips

Berichtdoor wasibi » 01 jan 2017, 18:03

Altijd leuk om die volhardende benamingen voor een cardan te zien.
Zoek je een differentieel op MP dan kun je het beste zoeken op cardan :lol:

Maargoed, ik ben van plan mijn cardan van de week weg te brengen naar Rietveld aandrijfassen.
Hier moet de kruiskoppeling worden vervangen en de centreerbussen.
De kruiskoppeling zit hier vast gestanst en niet met clips.

Ik ben wel zo stom geweest om de as los te trekken :( , of dit de onbelans veroorzaakt weet ik niet.
Kennelijk is het zo dat bij vroege types de as in 1 geheel werden gebalanceerd. Later afzonderlijk.
Merktekens heb ik niet gezien.. best wel erg on-mercedes :roll:

Zal het resultaat posten. Kosten +/- 250 Euro ex. centreerbussen en tussenlager zelf meenemen.

Al met al een dure exersitie..
Groet,
Alex
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Re: cardan demonteren ww14 tips

Berichtdoor Govert » 01 jan 2017, 23:11

Als je de as toch wegbrengt naar een aandrijfassenbedrijf, dan kunnen ze hem waarschijnlijk ook balanceren.
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Re: cardan demonteren ww14 tips

Berichtdoor Henk Lith » 02 jan 2017, 01:21

Het is misschien niet onverstandig om eerst even te kijken of er onbalans in de cardanas / assen zit.
Als je de auto op een brug zet (ok,,, moet je wel hebben natuurlijk) en je laat iemand in de auto zitten, dan til je de achterwielen op, brugkrik, of iets anders simpels, dan start je de auto, en laat je de wielen draaien door te koppelen.

Nu kan de persoon die onder de auto staat op een punt of een paar punten met een viltstift (maakt niet uit welke kleur), heel langzaam richting as schuiven, als er nu een slag in zit zie je een kleur streep op de as komen.
Dat betekend dat je aan de andere kant een verzwaring moet aanbrengen, bv. met een slangklem!
Ik heb dat bij mijn 200D W110 ook zo gedaan resultaat was zeer bevredigend, had ik geluk?

Het zo geconstrueerde contra gewicht, moet natuurlijk maar net juist zijn.

Maar dit gewicht justeren kan je natuurlijk helemaal goed krijgen door met twee slangklemmen te werken.
Je kan met de positie van die tweeklemmen een juiste resultante en gewicht, zelfs van twee klemmen in stellen.
Als het gewicht van 1 slangklem te veel is kan je onder dat gewicht van 1 slangklem komen door de kracht vector weer anders in te stellen,,, spreekt dat een beetje tot de verbeelding? (simpele mechanika toch)

Groet, Henk

NB: het heeft mij nog geen 2 euro gekost dus :lol:
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Re: cardan demonteren ww14 tips

Berichtdoor wasibi » 03 jan 2017, 10:29

Uiteraard wordt de as gebalanceerd En voorzien van merktekens :handgestures-thumbup:

De slangklem methode is een grote natte vinger maar kan zeer zeker effectief zijn! Vooral voor een oldtimer die af en toe buiten komt om een toerritje te doen. Om dan een hoop geld uit te geven voor die paar kilometer is onzin.

Als de as 6000 rpm moet kunnen maken en gebruik voor lange ritten is het een slecht idee ;)

De grote vraag die men moet stellen is, wat is de oorzaak van de onbalans?
Op de as zitten kleine plaatjes gepuntlast die de onbalans compenseren. een slangklem is een behoorlijk gewicht daarmee in vergelijk.

Nummer 1 verdachte is de kruiskoppeling, een kapot lager (1 van de 4) hier veroorzaakt de meeste trilling. het tussenlager zit vrij flexibel en heeft geen dempende massa.
Nummer 2 de centreerbussen zijn defect en de as word onder belasting 1 kant op getrokken.
Nummer 3 de hardy schijven zijn defect. hoeft niet eens zichtbaar te zijn.
Nummer 4 hahaha bouten van verschillende lengte in de hardy koppelingen.. geen geintje!

En natuurlijk opbokschade, iets heeft de as geraakt. Brugkrik, heftrucklepel enz.

Het tussenlager zelf maakt alleen herrie als deze kapot is. Het rubber rondom dit lager is wel vaak aan gort.
Uitendelijk kost dit je je centreerbussen.
Groet,
Alex
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Re: cardan demonteren ww14 tips

Berichtdoor wasibi » 09 jan 2017, 19:59

Cardan terug van revisie, nieuw kruisstuk geplaatst en tussenlager geleverd.
Zelf aangeleverd de centreerbus en tussenlagersteun orgineel MB.

Al met al een duur grapje, uiteindelijk 325€ :(
Je kunt goed de opgelaste plaatjes zien als compensatiegewicht, ook zijn de 2 stukken gemerkt.

Gedaan door Rietveld Aandrijfassen te Oosterhout NB.

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wasibi
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Re: cardan demonteren ww14 tips

Berichtdoor Henk Lith » 10 jan 2017, 00:37

Mooi Alex, kost inderdaad een paar centen, maar de beste optie in technische zin natuurlijk.
Ben benieuwd hoe dat gaar rijden.
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Re: cardan demonteren ww14 tips

Berichtdoor w114wouter » 11 jan 2017, 16:40

Heeft iemand er wellicht een werkinstructie voor, als je alleen bent ?

Ik heb een put tot beschikking.

Is het bv verstandig om de hardeschijf van de versnellingsbak/diff los te halen, of eraan te laten zitten en de cardanas van de hardyschijven af te halen ?
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Re: cardan demonteren ww14 tips

Berichtdoor Wiebren240D » 11 jan 2017, 22:23

Hoi

de Hardschijven maakt niet uit hoe je die plaatst zijn flexibel als ze al oud zijn en dus hard zijn geworden is het verstandig om ze allebeide te vervangen.
de aandrijfas zelf goed merken met een spuitbus dat kun je mooi op de foto"s van de vorige poster zien dan kan er niks gebeuren.

wens je suc6 met de groeten van Wiebren ut Snits telnr 0620659789
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Re: cardan demonteren ww14 tips

Berichtdoor w114wouter » 12 jan 2017, 09:50

En dan nu de hamvraag: Is dit een klus die je in je eentje (zonder hulp) kunt doen? En zo ja: Welke stappen kan je dan het beste doorlopen ? :)
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Re: cardan demonteren ww14 tips

Berichtdoor Wiebren240D » 12 jan 2017, 12:13

Hallo Wouter

dit is best allen te doen.
gewoon de hardy schijven laten zitten en de aandrijf as bij de versnellingsbak los maken.
dan de grote moer in de midden iets los maken dat de aandrijfas in elkaar kan schuiven.
als je de hardy schijven niet vervangt is het raadzaam om even met een spuitbus verf te merken zodat de aandrijfas weer op dezelfde plek word terug geplaatst.
in de midden ook goed merken met verf op de beide as delen want als je alleen bent wil het wel gebeuren dat als je de aandrijfas eruit haal dan in 2 delen valt.

ik wens je suc6 met het herstel.
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Re: cardan demonteren ww14 tips

Berichtdoor w114wouter » 17 jan 2017, 08:24

Nou het is gelukt hoor :)

Eerst voorkant, toen tussenlager, vervolgens handrem losnemen en toen de achterkant.

Helaas kwam ik er, toen de cardan eronderuit lag, wel achter dat de 'nieuwe' cardan een zwaar punt in de kruiskoppeling had :woohoo: Dus nu weer de oude er terug onder gezet :whistle: En ik laat een nieuwe kruiskoppeling in de andere zetten..

Volgende keer gaat het klusje een stuk sneller :handgestures-thumbup:
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